what about this....

[imitation-music]

Making a section on this forum for people that are new to mixing so they can swap audio tracks and mix each others stuff? Hey itd be like the blind leading the blind but it would be good practice...

I mean once your done writing an essay, you usually have other people proofread it because they catch the mistakes that you dont naturally. The one prob I forsee is copyright issues and stuff of that nature...


MAYBE?

[Sip]

I thought of the same kind of thing. Maybe Sonic Valley could give us a little homework, say one session consisting of a drumkit, guitars, bass and vocals. We could download the waves (no comp, or FX) and load them into our systems and then work away. After we could compare notes and stuff. I bet we would end up with lots of different ideas(and sounds). We could do the same thing with mastering. No Vance, I'm not volunteering you, I just thought that someome with more experiance might be able to head this up, you might be too busy.

[ethereal1]

that would rock...

[Roycanedo]

Yeah!!!!
Any ideas on how to begin?

[Sip]

We need someone to post some "raw" waves, (not mp3's, they suck) we download them, do our thing, post the results then we can all cut each other to pieces... I mean help each other:P

I think someone with lots of experiance should post the origional waves. We could then eliminate things like bad mic placement and stuff like that, if it's mixing we want to work on. If Sonic Valley is to busy maybe he could recommend a couple of other guys.

[This message has been edited by Sip (edited 07-13-2002).]

[Sonic Valley]

I think we may on to something guys. I have to pull all the samples I've posted of the work mixes thus far....there were some weird fans downloading them...my client wasn't too happy.

I'll look thru some sessions and make a quick little site for us to work from. We can have some optimal tracks as well as some not so optimal tracks that will test the skills. I can't promise too much, I'm really busy this summer and trying to take any free time and put it towards extreme mountain biking....lol

[imitation-music]

sounds great sonic, i cant wait to put my new monitors to the test when i recieve them.

[DS_Sultan]

Hmmmm, this sounds very much like the mixing clinic we had proposed a few months back, but got shot down because of logistics. Recording software issues, time frame, legality of the samples or song, plugs to use (free or otherwise) etc...

I tried to run something like this, Sonic you should remember, we had asked you to be involved, but the level of sarcasm that came out of the group was greater than the actual interest! If this idea is to be reserectd then great! I have a list of people who are waiting for such a thing.

I was, and am still ready, to reserve space on my site for this. If anyone is still interested.

[martin armsby]

Well I think its a great Idea. The only problem in the participation would be the download ability - takes me an age to dowload a decent MP3 sample (4-5 meg)so have you all got broadband or what?
And even if you have - the upload speed is usually 128k ....
cheers
M

[Sip]

Sultan,

You've probably noticed that it only takes a couple of negitive comments to turn a thread ugly, it's really easy to get sucked in. Hopefully the idea will fly this time.

Martin,

It may take a while downloading and uploading but I think it would a great learning tool.

[martin armsby]

Originally posted by Sip:
It may take a while downloading and uploading but I think it would a great learning tool.

I agree totally! - just thought real waves would not do - as someone had suggested.
So whats the format going to be ?

I think mp3 made with a decent tool at 160kb should cover the quality well enough.
Anyone ?



[This message has been edited by martin armsby (edited 07-14-2002).]

[Sonic Valley]

I've started tonight designing a site and how it'll all work. Got some tracks ready. I need to put some more thought into it but I think it's gonna be cool.

[mocsa]

Just two tips regarding the format:
- It can be WAV compressed with one of the freeware LOSSLESS wav compression tools. The compressed file will be around 50-70% of the original.
- mp3 encoded with LAME (freeware) using the -r3mix option. I think it cannot be distinguished from the original. Would be more than enough for mixing. Compressed file will be 15-20% of the original wav. After decoding (maybe using the high quality MAD decoder, which is freeware, as well) you can insert the file into your favourite mixing app.

[Michael Quayle]

This sounds very exciting - both for the newbies out there and the guys like myself who dont see as much studio time as they'd like these days ;(

[Sonic Valley]

I'm a firm believer in that there's no such thing as a lossless compression. All tracks wil be in .wav format. There won't be full songs. Prolly 2 min max.

[imitation-music]

as long as the server you are hosting them from isnt sllllllooooooooooooooowwwwww, then i am all for the .wav idea.

[Sonic Valley]

We have our own windows media swerver capable of supporting 5000 listeners at once. We're ok for bandwidth and speed.

[mocsa]

I think there is no need to be afraid of lossless compressors, at all. They are nothing more than a winzip, just the algorithm is optimised for sound files. If you want, you can even use winzip, but you will only get around 20% compression.
However, since I have a very fast connection, I'm not insisting on compression at all. But I can remember those days, when I had a hard time accessing the net, and then I liked mixing to the same extent as I like it today...

If any of you is interested, here is a comprehensive test of 10 lossless wav compressors:
http://www.firstpr.com.au/audiocomp/lossless/

[This message has been edited by mocsa (edited 07-16-2002).]

[Michael Quayle]

Is there any reason that both can't be made available? WAV for those with the bandwdith, MP3 for those that dont? Remember with WAV files, even 2 minutes of a drum kit with 6 mics is going to amount to a 60MB download, assuming we aren't dealing with 24bit files, if we are then its closer to 90MB, no? I am sure many people would be willing to sacrifice the audio to some extent in order to bring that download in around the 8MB mark. Not only that but there is the not so small matter of making your mix available to everyone else to critique. I cant see many people prepared to download (or upload, for that matter)multiple 20-30meg WAV files of the same 2 minutes drumming, but if that was a 2-3MB mp3, then I'm sure many more people would be willing to lend constructive criticsm to others' mixes. I have heard very good results with the latest Lame encoder at 160kbps and I'm sure for the purposes of this exercise it wouldn't be such a terrific sin to use some sort of compression on what would be otherwise unfeasibly large file transfers to many of the visitors to these forums.

[Sonic Valley]

The thing is that posting tracks as an mp3 will render the whole project useless (quality wise)..but hey we don't want to exclude anyone from the fun so we can do wav and mp3. I've registered a domain and am building the site now. We should be ready to rock in a week or two complete with it's own forum and live chat and other goodies. Stay tuned!

[JF]

Hi!
Good idea! I realy learned to love this
forum, it supports me since the day i started! And i always loved the point to point serie @prorec.com, so if we can make
something similar, interactive here - great!!
I'll stay tuned!!

J

[Sonic Valley]

The new site is www.musicmixingonline.com (http://www.musicmixingonline.com) and should be up soon...it's looking cool. I'm making this for you guys so suggestions on features and whatnot would be great. Cheers!

[imitation-music]

Everything seems to be working out well. Nice work Sonic Valley.

Oh, and if you need any help with graphics let me know and I will be glad to help you spruce it up. Lastly, I run my own server so if you are tight on space I might be able to host something also.

Once again, great job...

[This message has been edited by imitation-music (edited 07-17-2002).]

[Sonic Valley]

Excellant. I'll prolly be calling on you for a few favors then. I'm doing the graphics myself...Damn it Jim I'm not a graphic artist! lol I have access to a super dude for design but seeing this is all freebie stuff I need to keep costs down. We'll have some tracks available for people to download and mix but for the most part I think people will be responsible for their own ftp.

[imitation-music]

Ok, if you need anything just send me an email with the details.

And as for www.musicmixingonline.com's (http://www.musicmixingonline.com's) format i've been trying to think of a good way to keep it running smoothly. The one problem I would be afraid of is having 500 people submitting songs at once and everyone will be trying to comment but it will be one big disorganized mess!!!! lol. ahhh! Anyone see what i'm trying to say?

I want to hear how you plan on doing this Sonic...as far as the format of this site will go? Will it be like audioforums.com? Just one big message board?

One idea i'm thinking MIGHT work (dont hold me to it) is using the forum format and seperating it into each genre of music. Or you could even go as far as having a credit based system where people have to review/comment/mix before they can have their work reviewed/commented on/mixed. Or you could just have a few songs that everyone would be mixing posted by the admin of the site...

I think that there are a lot of good ways to go about setting the site up so it is productive and organized...

These are just things I have thought of and they might be totally off with what you wanted to do. I'll keep pondering this though...but for now im off to the beach!!! Weeeeee....

[Michael Quayle]

Am I the only person who is having big trouble accessing that site or is the link currently down while construction is in progress?

[Sonic Valley]

Still in progress dude...trying to build a Freeride park in the back yard at the same time...ahhhhh....summer projects...lol. Stay tuned.

[Michael Quayle]

Ahh sweet http://www.audioforums.com/forums/wink.gif Have fun

[ethereal1]

so, sonic...not to be a bugger, but has this gone anywhere since july?

thanks

[Sonic Valley]

Hey dude...Ya...I'm lazy...I've got the domain and a good start on the site...can't gaurentee when it'll be ready...keep bugging me tho...

I could use some help from someone setting up a chat room and message board...

[ethereal1]

i've got a message board script laying around that someone gave me to use on one of my sites...haven't used it yet (i need to get up the gumption to go invest in some webspace with script features), so i don't know how well it works, but i think it may be on par with what we've got here at audioforums. In any case, i can send it to you if you want.

eric

[Sonic Valley]

Here's a start...
http://www.sonicvalley.com/mmo/index.htm

[ethereal1]

cool! looks good so far http://www.audioforums.com/forums/smile.gif

[Sonic Valley]

Are things getting cut off in your browser? I'm working in 1280 res so it's hard to tell..

[ethereal1]

no...but i'm in 1280 res too http://www.audioforums.com/forums/wink.gif I find the best way around that is to make your outermost table a fixed width of 760 pixels. That way, it will fit on any screen 800x600 and up.

[Sonic Valley]

OK...It's coming along...I'm looking for input on what other features you guys want http://www.sonicvalley.com/mmo/index.htm

[imitation-music]

i would not have music play when you enter the site. but the layout looks very nice http://www.audioforums.com/forums/smile.gif

[Michael Quayle]

I agree, it's shaping up very nicely. One small thing ,and I stress this is purely a personal thing, but I always trust sites that don't 'abuse' the status bar with scrolling messages and that gladly display the URL of a link when I hover over it. Don't ask me while I feel that because I can't possibly tell you - the only explanation I can offer is that I probably have some deep rooted mistrust of sites that refuse to display link URL's - they are usually involved in some sort of aggressive and invasive marketing scam or other.
Well, that's enough of my little diatribe - I am looking forward to the finished article - I think it's a great idea and I'm very grateful of the time and energy you are investing, not only on this new project, but also on these forums. Great work, please keep it up!

Thanks for now,
Michael.