PC Ugrade Question - Is this possible?

[Kurdish Mayfield]

I'm currently operating a PIII 667 PC which was built by a friend in a Micron case. Its got an Asus motherboard (P3V4X). I'm desperate to get more power and I'm wondering if its possible to upgrade by removing the motherboard and installing a new one with a faster processor and new ram.I don't want to build from scratch as I can't afford it. Any reason this can't be done?

[Pretty Pretty Cyanide]

What you are stating is building from scratch. And it isn't that complicated.

What Mhz\Ghz range were you looking at?
Staying within Intel?

Also note you have a Via chipset. And the highest CPU it can take is a 800mhz.


If you are getting a new mobo you can keep your harddrives, soundcard, video card, and network card (if applicable).

You might have to upgrade your RAM to something other than SDRAM depending on what mobo you choose.

[Floydian]

There is no reason that can't be done kurdish

All you need is a new mobo, cpu, and ram, as you correctly stated. And unless your still on ISA devices as opposed to PCI, then you might need to upgrade them as ISA is no longer a supported form factor, but anyway, not to worry I don't think.

Whatever you do, stay away from VIA chipsets, if your point was to upgrade to get more out of your computer music wise, then it wasn't worth it if you get a new mobo with a VIA chipset. Go either Intel for Intel cpu's or nVidia for AMD's

also, you might need a new power supply, check what the mobo and cpu need (watts) and compare that to your power supply. 300Watts is usually sufficient but if your running 4 HDD's and a lot of other crap, then you might need something more powerful.

[Polaris]

Originally posted by Floydian:
There is no reason that can't be done kurdish

All you need is a new mobo, cpu, and ram, as you correctly stated. And unless your still on ISA devices as opposed to PCI, then you might need to upgrade them as ISA is no longer a supported form factor, but anyway, not to worry I don't think.

Whatever you do, stay away from VIA chipsets, if your point was to upgrade to get more out of your computer music wise, then it wasn't worth it if you get a new mobo with a VIA chipset. Go either Intel for Intel cpu's or nVidia for AMD's

also, you might need a new power supply, check what the mobo and cpu need (watts) and compare that to your power supply. 300Watts is usually sufficient but if your running 4 HDD's and a lot of other crap, then you might need something more powerful.

Vias for AMD's are ok, I would just stay to the newer KT333 or KT400's.

PCI is good.....can't wait for PCI Express to come out next year!!! (500MB/sec transfer rate).

[nutsadamus]

You can now get a whole new P4 system from Dell or the like (including monitor) for around 450 bucks. If I was you, I'd save up a couple hundred dollars and just do that. A current mobo, cpu, and ram combination will cost you no less than $200, so for an extra $250 you get a new case & power supply, a new CD-RW or even DVD-RW, a new hard drive, and a 17" monitor. Not to mention free shipping, tech support, and Windows XP.

It's not that I don't advocate building your own, its just that the deals going on nowadays are pretty insane.

Do a google search for "Dell online rebates" and you'll find a ton of sites with coupon and rebate codes that might bring the price of the system down even further.

[Nick Driver]

Originally posted by nutsadamus:
You can now get a whole new P4 system from Dell or the like (including monitor) for around 450 bucks.

All the jokes aside, the current crop of low-budget Dells aren't half-bad at all, we just bought a whole bunch of Dimension 2350 bare-bone business PCs for work, and they seem to be a lot of bang for the buck. The power supplies are a bit wimpy, but just adequate for the job. The mobos (i845GL chipset) in them appear to be genuine manufactured by Intel for Dell, and seem rock-solid stable, however there is no AGP slot so you're stuck with the imbedded video, unless you want a PCI video card which is a big no-no in a DAW. You also only get 3 PCI slots.

[This message has been edited by Nick Driver (edited 04-22-2003).]

[Polaris]

I just spec'd a Dell 2350....

P4 2.2Ghz
256MB DDR
60gig 7200rpm
48x CDRW
no AGP slot =(
17" monitor

$769, minus $150 rebate for $619 total.

From Newegg.com, with a 2.4Ghz,52x CDRW AGP slot and onboard graphics, with name brand components (Seagate, Viewsonic, Lite-On,Crucial) and legal version of WinXP Home:

$677.99 no rebate.

I'd take the homebuilt, with no Dell cheese, please.

[This message has been edited by Polaris (edited 04-22-2003).]

[Tune Machine]

Kewl handle. I love Curtis Mayfield! Sorry, just had to interject. http://www.audioforums.com/forums/wink.gif

[stompbox]

What happens if the motherboard or a component is DOA? All the local stores tell me I would need to return the processor or board back to the manufacturer instead of a direct replacement if THEY put the computer together.

Have you guys found this to be true?

Is there a lot of trouble-shooting involved nowdays? Do most boards "just work"?

[nutsadamus]

http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx?CS=19&kc=6V774&oc=D23TVP

The deal here is $500 after rebate. Sure, if you know what you're doing you can put something together thats alot better. I'm not debating that. The big downside to the Dell which I didn't realize until NIck pointed it out was the lack of AGP.

However, Im just giving Kurdish another option to consider.

[Kurdish Mayfield]

Firstly thanks for all of the replies!Amazingly the reason that I asked this question was that I'd seriously been considering buying a Dell . In fact I price a setup every few days and the deals are amazing. I signed up for their mailing and they're now offering a 2.4 PIV with 15" flat panel for $499. I'm thinking about something like this and getting additional memory on my own. I wanted to posts with opinions about Dell but I never ever see an honest discussion on other boards.(I'm new as a poster here) Usually the anti corporate types swarm a thread proclaiming the horrors of Dell without much to back it up. I've been at daw recording for years but I've no inclination for building and can't justify a large outlay at this time. Would a decently spec'd Dell be so bad? Again thanks for your input.

[Bops2000]

My own personal thoughts would not to go DELL

[nutsadamus]

Why not?

[Polaris]

Originally posted by nutsadamus:
Why not?


I've worked on Dells. I really do not like them at all.

Plus anyone who thinks their "service" is great really needs to rethink their ideas of service.

30 minute hold times are crazy for people to be excited over.

I had to call once on a notebook, and I held for 30 just to find out I need to flash the bios.

[Kurdish Mayfield]

First of all I want to stress that I mean no disrepect to the people that have taken time to respond to this thread. However the replies regarding Dell are the same as I've seen at every site forever. Long on hearsay and emotion and short on facts or specifics.From reading quite a bit about this it seems that if you want to get a super daw that will acheive the benchmark state of the art limits in terms of #of audio tracks and vsti's or effects ,you need to build it yourself. You can carefully choose this mobo,that ram etc. But I still wonder why a well spec'd Dell won't give solid performance.

[Polaris]

Originally posted by Kurdish Mayfield:
First of all I want to stress that I mean no disrepect to the people that have taken time to respond to this thread. However the replies regarding Dell are the same as I've seen at every site forever. Long on hearsay and emotion and short on facts or specifics.From reading quite a bit about this it seems that if you want to get a super daw that will acheive the benchmark state of the art limits in terms of #of audio tracks and vsti's or effects ,you need to build it yourself. You can carefully choose this mobo,that ram etc. But I still wonder why a well spec'd Dell won't give solid performance.

My comment on service time would have been factual, if I had kept a time stamp on it.

But the real reason, the fact that Dell along with all the other OEMs through whatever **** they get the cheapest into their systems is what keeps me from buying one.

I'll see if I can find the page where it lists what Dell actually uses in their boxes.

[Nick Driver]

All the mass-produced OEM vendors' service sucks. That's just a part of getting a ready-made machine for a relatively cheap price. I once had to cuss out a Gateway service punk, and demand to talk to his manager, to get a new motherboard shipped out for a brand new Gateway 2.0GHz machine that dies after less than a week of ownership... this was only back in December 2002. We've had similar experiences with Dell, IBM and Compaq too. I'm the network admin for a small city govt, and deal with this kind of stuff on a regular basis. Last year we bought a new Dell server for our public transportation management system and the DLT tape backup drive died after less than a week of ownership. We had to get into a shouting match with them to get a new tape drive RMA'd and sent out. They're so screwed up they sent us two replacement tape drives, and refused acceptance of the old one once it was shipped back to them, claiming an invalid RMA number was given, so we got the old faulty drive back. They would never give us an RMA number for the extra drive eiether so we just kept it, and never got billed for it. Good for us since we got a spare DLT drive out of the deal for free (which we needed because the other one just bit the dust a few days ago, so now the 3rd unit is in service and now two dead ones are tossed into the junk parts pile), but this is just one example of the comedy of errors their service system represents. Now that I've done ragging on Dell, Gateway, et al, I do have to say that when the machines work, they do the job expected of them just fine.

Kurdish, a current Dell P4 machine probably would work pretty decent as an entry-level DAW with single monitor and the default graphics interface... just like a Ford Focus or Honda Civic is a pretty decent passenger car. Just don't expect to go out and win any NASCAR races with it :-). Don't expect to be able to upgrade it much either, since you'll probably run into limitations like the aforementioned lack of AGP slot, unless you get one of the more higher-up models. Don't expect to be able to change out mobo/cpu/whatever later on either, Dell has in the past had a nasty habit of changing the sizes and shapes of otherwise standard stuff, just enough to make it proprietary to thwart the user from upgrading it later with non-DELL parts. If you really do intend to have yourself a custom high-performance DAW, you need to build a hotrod system with the appropriate components.

PS: if you want to play 3D video games on your DAW too (as idiots like me do), the default imbedded graphics interface of the cheap DELL ain't gonna cut it at all... it'll suck pretty badly.

[This message has been edited by Nick Driver (edited 04-23-2003).]

[Pretty Pretty Cyanide]

You still haven't answered my first questions.

And are you sticking to SDRAM? Or are you moving to DDR (or Rambus)?

Mind you, you can get a 2Ghz or more computer and still use SDRAM and still be flying with sequencers and vst's.

With that route all you need is a mobo and a cpu that fits.

[nutsadamus]

This site posts some pretty crazy Dell deals everyday.
http://www.gotapex.com/deals.php


Everyone's got their own opinions about building or buying pre-configured (personally, I like to build my own). But, if you have limited funds and modest performance requirements, then I don't see anything wrong with buying a prebuilt from Dell, or Gateway, or whoever.

[Kurdish Mayfield]

Cyanide:
Regarding your question about memory, I don't know what I'd be going after. My initial question was could it be done . Since the answer seems to be yes, If I go this route I'll have to research and see whats best. I'm open for any suggestions. I'd also like to know, if I did take out my current mobo,and installed a new mobo,proc and ram could I reinstall an existing copy of Windows XP.

[Nick Driver]

New mobo, cpu and new memory to fit that mobo would also probably require a new power supply as well since if you go with a P4 based mobo, you'll need that extra "ATX12" power supply connector that your current power supply most likely doesn't have. If you go with an Athlon XP based mobo, you need at bare minimum a good, stout 350W or stronger power supply, preferably 400W. Athlons are power-hungry and make a lot more heat than a P4.

I just remembered that I still have an old ASUS P3V4X mobo myself. It is a regular-sized ATX mobo, so your existing case and other stuff will likely be OK for upgrading. I didn't run my P3V4X very long because it made constant crackles and pops in my audio (was running an SBLive card back then) which made this mobo completely unfit for recording duty, and I changed over to a Soyo BX chipset mobo and ran that till I built my current P4 Northwood-based DAW.

I have no idea what trouble you might have to go thru, re-activating a copy of Windows XP (with its cdrom install key code) that was formerly on a completely different set of hardware and activated with that hardware. MS might let the new re-activation slide right on thru, or they might accuse you of piracy and refuse to re-activate your copy and make you have to go buy another one. This is a gamble that you can only find out by trying.

[This message has been edited by Nick Driver (edited 04-24-2003).]

[Nick Driver]

Kurdish,

Go have a look at www.newegg.com (http://www.newegg.com) (great online pc parts vendor, one of the best on the planet).

ASUS P4B533 mobo (great DAW mobo) $104.99
P4 2.4BGHz retail cpu $163.00
512MB SimpleTech PC2100 DDR $ 57.00
(el-cheapo brand, but adequate)
Allied 400W Power Supply $ 32.99
------------------------------------------
$357.98
add shipping ~$10 - $15

Not all that bad an upgrade if your existing hard drives, cdrom/cd-rw, video card, etc, are still re-useable. I'd try to also include a better video card too if you can afford it, like maybe an ATI Radeon 7500 or 8500, yesteryear's bargain, with dual video ports if you ever get a chance to add a second monitor.

This cpu + mobo will be so much faster than a 670MHz P3V4X machine, the comparison will be ridiculous.

[This message has been edited by Nick Driver (edited 04-24-2003).]

[Kurdish Mayfield]

Nick:
Thanks for that reply. Thats exactly the kind of info I needed. I'll check this out

[parkker]

check out here too for good deal on Dell
4550: http://www.bensbargains.net/

Look around it's there but these deals change often. I have this system only with 2.66 gig P4. I added some ram and second HD with 8meg cache and CDRW. Hard drive usage is a non issue @ 07% peak so far. Mine came with 60GB and I added 200 GB second drive they are both on primary IDE. CPU peaks so far at about 20% with 6 tracks running about 7 plug ins @ 3ms latency. I am pretty new at this so it might be tweaked further, though i've applied about every tweak to streamline I could find so far. Also running Sonar XL 2.2 and Q10. Very clean playback and the Dell runs basically noiseless as far as fans, etc. am happy with it so far. Also, I added ram and am @ 640 total. 256 this system comes with would suffice for the most part I'm sure or easily get you started. This sytem has AGP slot so I am changing card to Matroc G450 and have to Dell 18" flat panels waiting to connect up. Still have less than $1000 into this system. Oh I also partitioned drive so OS, programs are seprate on main drive with balance for data storage, and of course, second drive is for data stream audio only.

[Kurdish Mayfield]

Parker:
Which model did you get ? Was it the Demension series or a workstation?

[Bops2000]

dells suck
hockey puck
chit outta luk

(bops haiku)

[parkker]

4550 dimension 533 fsb, 2.66 ghz

[Pretty Pretty Cyanide]

K how about this.


How much are you able\willing to spend?