Setting up Sound System for Animation Studio.

[fybs]

Hello.
I am an Animation Artist and I would like to ad a new sound system to my studio. So I need advise from you people in deciding what do I really need.

What I already have:
Hardware:
Intel Core 2 CPU 6700@ 2.66 Ghz 2.67 Ghz, 2,00 GB RAM
Mini Disc
Microphones
Sony U-Matic Videocassette Recorder, (soon hopefully Beta).

Software:
Adobe Audiotion 1.5

I will have to add sound to my film.
Please tell me if I am wrong with the options I choose.
I have had a look at Propellerhead Reason, thinking that it will help me in constructing several noises that I can not create just by recording them with a microphone. I also can create the Classical Background Music within Reason.
After I have created sound effects and the Classical Background Music I can then Mix it and refine it in Adobe Audition 1.5. And then edit it in Adobe Premiere Pro and Adobe After Effects.
Is this the right procedure or would you go about it a different way if you already have Adobe Audition 1.5.

Now the Hardware.
I have had a look at some Sound Cards and can not decide which is best for me.
I must add that my budget is tight limited. So Soundblaster X-Fi Elite Pro sounds quite promising.
Is there something more adequate and professional in a similar price range that matches the need of an animation studio?

Thank you for any help.
Kind regards.
Fybs.

[jmail]

I'd stay away from any "consumer" card, including the X-Fi. I'd lean more toward like an M-Audio 2496 or EMU 0404 as a minimum. But, perhaps you want to do 5.1 surround? Or perhaps you prefer a firewire solution? Or USB2?

[fybs]

Thank you jmail.
I have had a look at M-Audio 2496 and EMU 0404 and I think I prefer the EMU 0404, for it has the optical in/outs as well. I also had a look at the EMU 1212M AUDIO SYSTEM and the fire wire option EDIROL FA-66 and I am more confused now.

What if I do decide to render my film with a 7.1 or at least 5.1 surround sound?

I have forgot to mention that I have an ASUS P5W DH Deluxe motherboard with a high definition onboard audio, Realtek ALC882M 8-channel CODEC. It supports Multi-Streaming, Jack-Sensing and Jack-Retasking Technology; Anti-Pop Funktion; Optical andCoaxial S/PDIF Out interfaces; Dolby ProLogic IIX; Dolby Headphone; Dolby Virtual Speaker; Dolby Digital Live.
Don’t know what it all means but maybe I don’t need it anyhow. :rolleyes:

If I do decide to buy a fire wire option, will my computer still use the Realtek onboard sound or do I have to switch it off in BIOS?

As you can see, I am no sound technician, when it comes to acoustic Computer Hardware, that’s why I am so grateful for your help, but I manage to edit sound for my films quite reasonable I guess. If you like to see the short film clip I made in the Year 2000, here is a link: http://ravensteinstudio.com/Cinema/shorts/schwhund/shweinehund.mov

I recorded individual sound effects with one microphone connected to a portable mini disc and edited them with other sounds from a sound library in Adobe Audition. The computer I was using had a Soundblaster Live Soundcard.

The short animation film I am working on at the moment should be seen in independent art house cinemas and therefore I would like to produce the final edit in 5.1 or 7.1 surround sound. So here are my questions:

Is the EMU 0404 sufficient for this, or do I need the EMU 1212M?
When I use the fire wire solution, do I not still need a different soundcard in my computer and if yes, do I have to switch the onboard sound off?
You have even mentioned a USB2 solution. I have not found anything on that yet.
And what about the software, am I doing fine with choosing Propellerhead Reason in conjunction with Adobe Audition, or do I need some additional software?

I thank you and all of you that help me out in this matter.

Kind regards.
Fybs.

[walden]

Hi Fybs,
So I read the thread and will have a look at the M-audio & EMU soundcards.
Regarding producing music over video, actually I've made music for commercials last year. I won't be of much help regarding hardware but can tell you about the software I used.

I used Cubase rewired with Reason.
Cubase is great for this cause you can add a video track to your project, so you see the video real time when you work on it, and can put sounds at the exact millisecond you want on the movie (convenient for change of frames etc...). On Cubase you can also record live things, like guitar, voice, etc...

Then reason is great to do the music "background" as you said, and for "sound design" I was also recording live noises with a mini-disc or looking for samples on the internet.

Then I export everything as an audio file from cubase and master it on Wavelab (compression, denoiser etc...)

I don't know Adobe Audition personally.
Hope this helps.
Cheers

[fybs]

Thanks Walden.
Yes, you are right, I much prefer using cubase as well but unfortunately I have not got it at the moment. The reason why I use Adobe Audition is because it came with a bundle called Adobe Video Collection. I have bought it for it has After Effects etc. and Adobe Audition also has the features where you see the video footage at the precise place of your sound wave. It also works fine in conjunction with After Effects; Adobe Premiere Pro and Adobe Encore DVD.

Now, about the hardware I am thinking about Roland Edirol UA-4FX for 129.- Euro.
http://www.thomann.de/gb/edirol_ua4fx.htm It says on that site: “Dolby Digital or DTS 5.1 surround compatibility via S/PDIF output (Windows XP)” I don’t exactly know how that works. The Interface is connected by USB 2 to the computer, does the computer feed from and to the interface?
Where do I connect the S/PDIF on my computer to get the surround 5.1?
What happens to the onboard soundcard, and how do I know that the sound is produced in the external interface and not from the onboard sound chip?

To produce a 5.1 surround sound is a software matter and not a hardware, is it not?
Of cause one will need a 5.1 surround card to hear what you have created on your speakers but in the end the 5.1 surround is created within the software you use.
I know I am wrong there somewhere and I would be grateful if someone can correct me there.

If I acquire the Roland Edirol UA-4FX , do I still need a good 5.1 internal sound card?

Thanks again for any help.

[oretez]

(all standard 'mileage may vary' caveats apply)

Unless you require fairly sophisticated MIDI/Audio integration it is still difficult to find a more powerful audio editor then Audition. I've used AA (and it's earlier precursors Syntrillium's CE) for a decade for just the type of audio for vid you are describing.

There are some Rewire issues with Audition but, if I remember you can start to sort them out http://www.propellerheads.se/ (couple of clips among vid tutorials)

and if this parses correctly some more info might be available here (didn't parse correctly but here is the long form: http://www.audiomastersforum.net/amforum/search.php?mode=results&sid=d33276796939563797c699c71b3fa556)

Depending on your budget you don't need a dedicated 5.1 card to encode 6 audio files as 5.1, you can use an installed audio card with an add on. For the price the Emu 0404 is not a bad place to start

(once you figure it out PatchMix is a powerful utility)

it is worth adding that while rigorous specific 3rd party reviews of internal workings of the new creative card have yet to hit the web generally speaking for serious audio work it is best to steer clear of CL cards (and all consumer/gamer/home theater cards) . . . CL cards tend to have issues with serious audio setups (though there are thousands, probably tens of thousands, of people doing serious audio work on machines with CL cards installed) and extraneous bundled crap that installs automatically is very difficult to eradicate. Every CL card up to (perhaps) the newest had issues with how it dealt with variable sampling rates, bit depths.

If you do not think you will, in the near future, need to record, live more then two tracks simultaneously the Emu 0404 has much to recommend it (this is not a blanket recommendation for the Emu cards, but considering that CL purchased Emu, that I'm saying anything even vaguely positive is significant)

For about $250(US) you can pick up an Echo Gina(3G) . . . its convertors are comparable to the Emu and it sports six analog outs (in addition to s/pdif & adat) For about $350 the Emu 1616 gets you to 6 analog outs with six (if I remember) analog inputs

what combination of hardware/software that will work efficiently for you is highly dependent on you, the physical layout of your work space, and more importantly your work process. Audition is a very powerful audio editor but I'm not 100% sure that if my process had not evolved with evolution of software that it would be my first choice for Vid work at current time . . . I'm not sure that it wouldn't be . . . but interestingly enough while Adobe bought it primarily to enhance their Vid editing package. 1.5 is not quite ready for prime time (due largely to integration issues with other adobe product) V2 was a complete rewrite of the program and how powerful it might be for Vid work will have to wait for the next upgrade . . . which does not mean it can't be used for what you want as it stands . . . it can and since you already have it (unless you absolutely require audio/MIDI integration) you might as well use it to start to sort out your process

(oh, and audition also has video guide track capacity)
Even if your initial time frame precludes rewiring reason to audition, importing audio created in Reason into Audition should be a trivial task.

[fybs]

Hi Oretez.
Wow! What a great feedback.
Thank you for making it so clear. I very much appreciate it.

Thank you very much. :)
Cheers
Fybs