please help - FREEZES with SX2 especially during mixdown

[Ashmil]

Hi all

argh! this has only recently started happening - pretty much always now during Export Audio, the computer will completely freeze, and I have to restart. Also this can happen during just general use of Cubase.

Didn't used to happen! Only happens since I bought a new stick of ram. I was using 1 stick of Corsair Platinum 512MB DDR XMS3200C2PT CAS2. I decided it was finally time to upgrade to a Gig (and thus start using Dual Channel Mode). I bought another stick the same, and put it in. I did get better performance, but gradually realised that I was more prone to these crashes. I took the stick out, so back down to 512MB. Now I'm still getting crashed, only MORE! I have tried swapping the memory sticks with each other, and I have also tried swapping them between different slots on the mobo - makes no difference.

Please if someone could offer some advice, I'd be very grateful.

Here's my setup:

AMD Athlon Barton XP3200 + 400SB CPU
Asus A7N8X-E Deluxe nForce2 mobo
Corsair 512MB DDR XMS3200LLPT Low Latency Platinum CAS 2
Zalman CNPS7000B-Cu Ultra Quiet CPU Cooler
Antec Sonata Piano Black Quiet Case - 380W TruePower Silent PSU
Terratec DMX 6Fire soundcard
Radeon 9800 Graphics card

Any clues folks? am I overheating perhaps? I have Asus Probe running an all the temps show as OK...

yours hopefully

Alex

[itsplayed]

Wow...Where do you start? First I'd try setting the AGP speed down to 4x. I know that the ATI Radeon 9800 cards have had issues running at 8x on certain ASUS boards. Stepping down the speed has fixed these on other boards. Besides it's an easy. non-invasive and non-costly thing to try first.

[jmail]

Have you done any Windows updates lately? Installed any new software that may have interfered with your ASIO setup? Does SX play all your files prior to the export, other than the crashes? Does anything else besides SX crash? Does the screen freeze, or do you go to a BSD? Any abnormalities pop-up just before a crash, to where you know when one is coming? Any similarities to the circumstances? Also, what version of Windows? Have you run defrag & scandisk lately? Any problems with them? Does SX require a "validation" of your computer after you add memory? (in other words, does it need to know you change the system resources?)

[Ashmil]

Thanks for your response guys - I've a feeling this will require some detective work - gutted!

Ok, in response to your points:

itsplayed - I will presumably be able to change the AGP setting in the BIOS? I will try this. However I'm still concerned that this is a new problem which has developed without any changes to such settings.

jmail - many thanks for your extensive list of things to check.

- I have installed Windows updates as and when they have become available.
- new software interfering with ASIO? I have installed new things, but nothing that I would expect to impact on this.
- SX does play files prior to export. But it is prone to crashing if I am playing a semi-complex project, i.e. one with a number of tracks and FX. Newer tracks with less complexity do not crash. Exporting always crashes. I repeat, this never used to happen!
- Nothing other than Cubase crashes with one stick of RAM, although I was getting freezes with 2 sticks in when playing Unreal Tournament (I know it's evil to play games on your DAW, but the wisdom of this aside, I should still be able to run this computer without it freezing - and it's not been a problem previously).
- no BSD, the screen simply freezes - mouse won't even move or anthing.
- no pop-ups or any warnings precede the crash
- Windows XP Pro
- defrag and scandisk are run reasonably frequently
- SX does not require any validations or anything

I hope these points may prompt some wisdom from someone, I will continue to investigate myself... But any clues anyone else may have would be very welcome!

I hope I have articulated myself resonably well considering that I have drunk most of a bottle of Spanish sherry.

Thanks a lot

Alex

[itsplayed]

When you installed that ram, did you make sure to install to slot 1&3 or 2&3 respectively. Also as a rule of thumb I go about removing the graphics card prior to adding/removing ram(precautionary). You may also want to clear the CMOS prior to restarting then reconfigure the BIOS.
The next suspect would be your power supply IMHO. While Antec makes a good unit the 380w is a bit on the weak side, especially on the 12v rail. The sympoms you are experiencing do denote the beginnings of a dying/underpowered power supply.
This may also just be a direct result from using high performance ram. Due to the High Performance Memory design, motherboards or system configurations may or may not operate smoothly at the JEDEC (Joint Electron Device Engineering Council) standard settings (BIOS Default on the motherboard) such as DDR voltage, memory speeds and memory timing. You may need to confirm and adjust your memory settings in the BIOS accordingly for better system stability. This is especially true when using ram not listed on the ASUS QVL (qualified vendor list).

[Ashmil]

Originally posted by itsplayed
Wow...Where do you start? First I'd try setting the AGP speed down to 4x. I know that the ATI Radeon 9800 cards have had issues running at 8x on certain ASUS boards. Stepping down the speed has fixed these on other boards. Besides it's an easy. non-invasive and non-costly thing to try first.

thanks for the continuing advice guys, I'm working my way through it.

re: the above, I went into the BIOS - the only place I can see to set the AGP speed is the option that says something like AGP 8x Support - Enabled/Disabled. There is nowhere else I can set the AGP speed in terms of 4x or 8x or whatever, so is this the correct option? If it is, I did try disabling it, and it didn't help.

Alex

[Ashmil]

Originally posted by itsplayed
When you installed that ram, did you make sure to install to slot 1&3 or 2&3 respectively. Also as a rule of thumb I go about removing the graphics card prior to adding/removing ram(precautionary). You may also want to clear the CMOS prior to restarting then reconfigure the BIOS.
The next suspect would be your power supply IMHO. While Antec makes a good unit the 380w is a bit on the weak side, especially on the 12v rail. The sympoms you are experiencing do denote the beginnings of a dying/underpowered power supply.
This may also just be a direct result from using high performance ram. Due to the High Performance Memory design, motherboards or system configurations may or may not operate smoothly at the JEDEC (Joint Electron Device Engineering Council) standard settings (BIOS Default on the motherboard) such as DDR voltage, memory speeds and memory timing. You may need to confirm and adjust your memory settings in the BIOS accordingly for better system stability. This is especially true when using ram not listed on the ASUS QVL (qualified vendor list).

Thanks for this - OK firstly, I installed the RAM according to the slot configurations listed in the mobo manual. And besides I'm back to only 1 stick now.

How easy is clearing the CMOS and reconfiguring the BIOS? Do most of the settings get auto-detected?

Re: the power supply - OK I hear you - but again, how difficult is replacing a power supply? I have put computers together before, but the PSU's have come as part of the case. What PSU should I go for?

Re: RAM settings, Okaaay... but confirming those settings is a little over my head... could you advise?

Again, very grateful for your suggestions.

Alex

[itsplayed]

Originally posted by Ashmil
Thanks for this - OK firstly, I installed the RAM according to the slot configurations listed in the mobo manual. And besides I'm back to only 1 stick now.

How easy is clearing the CMOS and reconfiguring the BIOS? Do most of the settings get auto-detected?

To clear the CMOS: Turn off computer, unplug power cord, open case, remove battery on MoBo(now would be a good time to actually replace the battery with a fresh unit), remove jumper cap from 1-2 position to 2-3 position, wait 5-15 secs, replace jumper cap to original position, reinstall battery. This info should be in your manual for the MoBo under [Clear RTC Ram/CMOS]. And yes, most of the setting's will be in Auto detect mode after clearing the CMOS. It's a good idea to scroll through those auto detect devices. After doing so, you will see the device listed, such as your hard drives, CD-Roms etc.

Re: the power supply - OK I hear you - but again, how difficult is replacing a power supply? I have put computers together before, but the PSU's have come as part of the case. What PSU should I go for?

Replacing the PSU is fairly simple, you just have four screws holding it in place on the back of the case. Each device connected to it must be unconnected first...Fans, Hard drives, Optical drives(CDRoms etc.) and MoBo and then of course reconnected after you mount a new PSU. Antec is a good brand to stick with, there are others such as OCZ, Zalman, Zippy, and probably king in PSU's IMHO is PC power & Cooling, but Antec is no slouch in this department. The Antec TruePower offerings are very good such as this...http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817103908 or this...http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817103937

Re: RAM settings, Okaaay... but confirming those settings is a little over my head... could you advise?

Agreed, At this time I'd advise not messing with the Ram's frequency or timings but rely on the default settings for now. Keep this in mind as a last resort. You may however look to see if the detected frequency matches your ram from within the BIOS.

Again, very grateful for your suggestions.

Alex

Your welcome Alex, Again first thing I'd try, is to clear the CMOS, reinstall the ram(both sticks), boot directly into the BIOS(default key at post) and give all settings the once over including the ram's frequency being detected. The manual can guide you through some of these settings. Disable as much as you feel comfortable in disabling...such as the on-board audio and any serial or printer ports not in use etc. Optimizing BIOS setting's for your graphics card is also a good idea, take a visit to the manufacturer's website of your card for these optimal BIOS settings.Remember to keep yourself grounded, grounding straps are best and can be bought in any computer store.

[Dags]

Your computer freezing sounds like a Ram problem. Maybe your memory is'nt quite compatible with your motherboard.

Reducing the speed the Ram runs at in Bios might make your system more stable.

;)

[itsplayed]

Originally posted by Dags
Your computer freezing sounds like a Ram problem. Maybe your memory is'nt quite compatible with your motherboard.

Reducing the speed the Ram runs at in Bios might make your system more stable.

;)

Yes, I agree and there are many BIOS upgrades that refer to giving added support for memory. I believe a reflash of the BIOS to the latest version may be in order. Since the ram Alex is using is on Corsair's compatability list, this may be the way to go, to solve the issue.
Alex, I believe this is the course of action needed. Install and run the ASUS BIOS UDATE UTILITY program that's found on your installation CD for the A7N8X-E Deluxe. Udate the BIOS to the latest version, I believe it's ver.1013. You may want to first try and stablize the system to it's previous state. Follow the last paragraph of my previous post, but only using that single stick of ram you ran with originally. After updating the BIOS you should be able to run with both sticks trouble free.

[Ashmil]

Alright, I did that and it appears that the problem is now solved! I flashed the BIOS with the latest version and - TOUCH WOOD - my problems have disappeared... no crashes in Cubase or Unreal Tournament, and I have both sticks of RAM in... SWEEET!

Hopefully it's not too good to be true (I was expecting more of a detective-work nightmare) - but for now, I'm a happy little boy.

Thanks again for all advice - much appreciated.

Alex

[itsplayed]

Glad to hear it Ashmil...Happy gaming and music making!